Interview: Dark Corners of the Old Dominion with Joe Maddrey

 

There's a new literary genre anthology published this month (just in time for the Halloween season...), focusing on horror stories set in Virginia.  

As the foreword for Dark Corners of the Old Dominion observes, Virginia is for lovers, but it is also for horror lovers.

I had the opportunity to discuss this new collection of riveting macabre stories with author Joseph Maddrey (To Hell You Ride, The Haunting, Nightmares in Red, White and Blue).  

Joe not only serves as an editor on this project, he also contributes one of the ghoulish tales.

Tell me how you came to be involved with editing the new literary anthology Dark Corners of the Old Dominion?

 

When I moved back to Virginia in 2021, I immediately starting looking for like-minded writers. I found my tribe in the Virginia chapter of the Horror Writers Association and a few of us started cooking up ideas for collaborative projects. The idea of a Virginia-based horror anthology had been floating around for several years, thanks to a writer named Dee Southerland, so we took the ball and ran with it. Luckily, three members of the editorial team—Red Lagoe, D. Alexander Ward, and Querus Abuttu—had more experience with anthologies than Mike Rook (my co-editor) and I did. We also had a lot of help from fellow authors Bryan Nowak and Nicole Willson. 

 

You are Virginian, born and bred, so this idea of horror stories set in that state is a natural for you. Did you grow up with any scary stories about Virginia, and if so, what were they? Do you have any local legends that still haunt you?   

 

I certainly grew up loving ghost stories and urban legends. Alvin Schwartz’s Scary Stories to Tell in the Dark was a big deal for me, as were Mary Downing Hahn’s early novels. Now I’m re-reading those with my daughter and also discovering new titles like the Virginia Mysteries series by Steven K. Smith and the Ameri-Scares series by Virginia native Elizabeth Massie. 

 

I know you are a student of local history. Why do you think Virginia makes a good match with horror?

 

I think what makes Virginia a good breeding ground for horror is its long history and wide variety. It’s a state that has seen a lot of change, a lot of wartime and political conflict, a lot of tragedy. And there’s so much variety in terms of landscape, geography and regional culture. The D.C. suburbs are worlds apart from the Shenandoah Valley, which is worlds apart from Hampton Roads. Unique places breed different kinds of horror stories.

 

Each of the stories is set in some town in Virginia, like Danville (“Odditorium,”), Gordonsville, or Church Hill (“The Song Between the Songs.”)  Was there any discussion about which towns would be included in the collection?  Did you try to cover a wide geographical area, or just let the authors choose the locations that inspired them?

 

We invited specific authors to submit to the anthology but didn’t give them any guidelines other than “your story / poem has to be set somewhere in Virginia.” As submissions came in, I was mapping the locations and excited to see we had stories set in most of the major regions of Virginia. The only exception was the Appalachian Plateau in the southwest corner of the state. We just didn’t get any stories set in that area. Eventually, we decided to organize the stories by region and Red Lagoe created a map showing where all 23 pieces were set. I love that map!

 

You set your own creepy story, “This is How Your Garden Grows” in Leeds.

 

In my mind, the fictional town of Leeds is somewhere in Madison County. That’s where my family lived when I started forming my earliest memories and I was somewhat inspired by my experience of growing up as a preacher’s kid in small-town Virginia. The story is also kind of a reaction to re-reading Ovid’s Metamorphoses a few years ago. It got me thinking: “What if things like this—people being turned into plants and animals—started happening to God-fearing people in small-town Virginia?” 

 

The stories here range widely in terms of horror sub-genre, with some being ghost stories, others being kind of “road trip gone wrong” tales and featuring urban legends. Did you try to cast as wide a net as possible in terms of horror content?

 

Again, we didn’t give authors any specific guidelines about what type of stories to write, but we wanted stories that were strongly rooted in the Virginia setting. It wasn’t enough to use a familiar place name; they had to express something unsettling about being in that particular place. And a lot of Virginians will be familiar with the settings in the anthology: Luray Caverns, Skyline Drive, the Crozet Tunnel, the Bunnyman Bridge in Clifton, the Dismal Swamp... There’s also a fun nod to Virginia native Edgar Allan Poe.

 

What are three stories in this anthology that surprised you the most, and why?

 

Right off the bat, “The Bride of Dream Lake” by Catherine Kuo was a story that worked for everyone on the editorial team. That was exciting and it’s why the story appears first in the anthology. I personally love the twist ending of William R.D. Wood’s story “Cave Kisses.” To me, it perfectly captures that E.C. Comics tone of horror. Valerie B. Williams also wrote a genuinely shocking tale called “A Mischief in Gordonsville.”

 

What three authors surprised you the most, and why?

 

I met Charles E. Wood before I read his submission and he’s such a humble guy that I think I underestimated him. His story “The Girl Who Sleeps in the Room Next to Me” is so short but so damn effective. That’s the mark of a good writer. I think Brad Center’s story “A House’s Tale” is brilliantly conceived. I was also impressed with Clay McLeod Chapman’s “Keep It Civil,” which is a very timely story and different from his novels. 

 

What story scared you the most, and why?

 

I have a weakness for what I think of as Twilight Zone horror: mind-bending, often metaphysical stories rooted in human emotions. There are several good examples of that in the anthology: “A Holler You Can’t Call Home” by Paul Michael Anderson, “The Wrong Time” by Ivy Grimes, “The Song Between the Songs” by J.T. Glover, “Doom at Dragon’s Roost” by Stephen Mark Rainey…. I was thinking about these stories long after I first read them. “Dragon’s Roost” was my introduction to the world of Mark Rainey’s fictional Sylvan County, which I think of as the Virginia equivalent of Stephen King’s Castle Rock. Once I realized Mark has been writing about that fictional place for more than thirty years, I fell down a rabbit hole.

 

You have edited manuscripts before, but was it difficult this time contending with so many different voices, genres, and ideas?  What was your guiding principle as editor?

 

I’m a compulsive organizer so I enjoyed the process. The seven members of the editorial team met and discussed our thoughts on each submission, then democratically decided which ones to accept. We were looking for strong writing, distinct voices, and compelling Virginia settings above all else. 

 

What is Scares that Care, and how does this book fit in with that organization?

 

Red Lagoe had the brilliant idea to make this a charity anthology with all of the author and publisher proceeds benefitting Scares That Care, a Virginia-based 501c3 charity. Every year, the organization puts on a horror-themed convention in Williamsburg to raise money for children and families afflicted by cancer or severe burns. And that’s just the tip of the iceberg. They are constantly hosting events and rallying horror fans to benefit people in need. You can learn more about the organization at https://scaresthatcare.org/ and support them by buying the anthology.

 

What is next for you, after this anthology?

 

I’ve spent the past three and a half years writing a comprehensive biography of Wes Craven. I interviewed over 100 people, including some who have never spoken publicly about Wes before. I also studied quite a few rare scripts and manuscripts by Wes, so I think this book will be an eye-opener for even his most ardent fans. I hope to get it out into the world by mid-2024. I’m also co-writing an essay for an anthology called Theorizing Stephen King. The essay will be closely related to a pair of books I wrote about adapting King’s work to the screen. 

 

What do you want readers to take away from this book?

 

In a way, I can’t believe Dark Corners of the Old Dominion is the first Virginia horror anthology. There’s a lot of untapped potential here and I hope the book will prompt readers to pay more attention to local talent. I’d just love to see more horror novels and anthologies by Virginia writers. 

Where can readers find the book?

 

It’s available from the usual retailers, in print and e-book editions. You can find a list of links on the publisher’s website at https://deathknellpress.com/2023/09/08/dark-corners-out-now/

Tales of Sley House: Interview with author Matthew Allair

I recently had the opportunity to catch up with Matt Allair, an author I have known and worked with many times over the years. He recently participated in a new horror anthology, Tales of Sley House, and I wanted to learn more about the genre collection, and his contribution, "Ghostly Visions," which evoked for me a sense of classic horror, reminiscent of both Lovecraft and 1970's TV efforts like Night Gallery.

John Kenneth Muir: Share with the readers how you came to be involved with Tales of Sley House, and what the anthology is all about.  What can you tell us about the publisher, and the project?

 

Matthew Anthony Allair: I am online friends with Richard Billingsley, a very fine author, due to our shared interest in the Paranormal. When his son Jeremy, another fine author, announced the launch of Sley House Publishing, and would soon be accepting submissions for short story authors, I leapt at the chance to be a part of the first anthology collection. I guess the flavor of the anthology is a little like the Crypt Keeper from the old 50s EC comics Tales from The Crypt. Sley House is a place to give new authors a chance to showcase their work. I like the attitude of the editors at Sley House, very pro author friendly. The editors, K.A. Hough and Trevor Williamson are quite good. I can’t go into specifics, but there were over sixty submissions and fifteen authors selected, so it’s a real honor to be a part of it. 

 

JKM: Tell me about your story, "Ghostly Visions." 

 

MAA: “Ghostly Visions” is about an art historian named Rogelio who is recruited by an art curator to visit a small town near Madrid, Spain to review a recently unearthed Francisco Goya painting titled ‘Ghostly Vision’ that connected to Goya’s black paintings period, but there’s a strange a dark history that connects all of it and things take a supernatural turn. A lot of my prose work is very cinematic. 

 

JKM: What made you want to tell this story, in particular?  What themes did you want to explore in a horror setting?

 

MAA: Well, a friend shared news about this recently rediscovered painting titled ‘Ghostly Vision’ which was credited to Francisco Goya, so it appears to be a very real work, I had already been writing prose since Jan 2021, when I saw the painting, the first idea that came to mind was Rod Serling’s Night Gallery, I then thought – someone should build a story around the painting, - then I realized I might as well do it. I had some strong ideas, but it wasn’t until I had completed the research into Francisco Goya, his work with the Black Painting period, and some of the stranger work like the Colossus, some of the stranger things about Goya’s personal life, then all of the dots connected, and the story almost wrote itself, uncanny really. For example, there’s a small sequence where the characters pass through a town where they find an open coffin with a headless corpse, that is taken from Goya’s passing, and the strangeness over his burial. The themes have to do with the power of symbols, mythology, and self belief in the power of fate. There’s a fixation towards Apocalyptic imagery, or a romanticism towards Dystopia’s. ‘Ghostly Visions’ and several others tales in my work are a reaction or comment to such interests.  Most people are prone to self destruction I have found, and it takes a lot of work to not lose your way. Be careful what you wish for. 

 

JKM: I know you, from years back, because we are both obsessed with The X-Files, and have both written about it in length. The idea in "Ghostly Visions" of belief vs. nonbelief, and figurative demons vs. psychological demons, feels apiece with the series' terrain.  Would you say that is the case?  Could the story of Rogelio be an X-File?

 

MAA: Well, The X-Files will always be close to my heart, the story isn’t directly influenced by The X-Files, I have very broad interests and influences aside from The X-Files, the themes of belief vs. non belief, and figurative vs. psychological demons have always fascinated me, there’s a lot of truth to the idea of Carl Jung’s notions about the shadow self, and how we need to overcome it. I suppose post event, that Mulder and Scully would be interested in the case. Yet being that it is set within international waters - unless the painting made the rounds in the United States - and an investigation called for their travel to Spain, I suspect the case would be out of their jurisdiction. I have always found a connection between Rod Serling, Leslie Stevens, Gene Roddenberry, and Chris Carter. I think all four are visionaries. 

 

JKM: You set "Ghostly Visions" in the world of art collection, and European history.  Are those subjects that are of special interest for you, and how does it the idea of a lost historic masterpiece fit with your vision? (And were you inspired at all by Lovecraft?)

 

MAA: I have an art college background, as much as film and story telling have always been my passion, so using the setting of the art world felt very much at home. As much as I have real problems with the industry politics of the art world, it’s a subject I am familiar with - the pros and cons. As far as lost masterpieces are concerned, there’s a lot of hidden history that people keep rediscovering, it doesn’t help that the world is in such turmoil at the moment. We have entered the 21^st century and there’s a lot of adjustments we are facing, and we don’t know which direction we are going to go towards. It seems we have to deal with the past before we can move forward as a society. 

 

As far as the Lovecraft influence, I saw Alien in 1979 and it scared the Hell out of me as a kid, but the film, and H.R. Giger, left an inkling, an imprint of ideas to explore. The Lovecraftian themes were embedded in me before I even knew who he was. A few years later in the early 80s when I got into Dungeons and Dragons, the Lovecraft mythos was used in campaigns, this would have been around sixth grade. Flash forwards a few years later when I was a freshman in High School, I got seriously into reading H.P. Lovecraft, and I mean, I read everything… including his poems and ‘Supernatural Horror In Literature’. But over time, the author and filmmaker who influenced me more was Clive Barker, there is a fearlessness in his work, his willingness to explore taboos, that influenced me to explore certain ideas, as much as I could never be as extreme as Clive is capable of being in his work, Clive really evolved my thinking about the terror and horror genres. 

 

JKM: Where can readers find Tales of Sley House, and what are you working on now? Where can we find other examples of your work?

 

MAA: The anthology collection Tales of Sley House has some very fine stories and authors, aside from my tale, so I hope people will check it out. You can order it through Amazon, Barnes and Nobles or directly through the publisher at Sley House. You can also special order it through Copperfields.

 

I started writing prose work in Jan 2021, and I hope the beginning association with Sley House will lead to something further, you never know. I have been pretty honest on Facebook about my journey with the work. I have two apocalyptic horror novellas, The Sea House and Trail of Tears that are pretty dark. I have a fantasy tale that is close to a novel, Sky Riders, could be described as Edgar Rice Burroughs meets George R.R. Martin. A hard science / science fiction tale, Redline, and various short terror and horror tales, The Silk Naif and The Gnat, Mesh, The Rooster That Would Not Stop, and The Last Shot. All of these are in various stages of editing, rewrites ,and proofing. My goal is to get a short story collection of these tales published, it depends on the marketplace. 

 

If I do get these published, I have nine other short story ideas, and two novel ideas, so a few more books in me, it all depends of future sales. I am also working with artists on three of these tales to do a graphic novel edition. One UK artist is in fact doing an illustrated version of Ghostly Visions, but again, it depends on if a comic publisher will be interested. I have been screen writing as well, and a friend is helping me to shoot a short horror film titled Roads before the summers end. I hope to get back on track with my three half hour films for Lotus Light Productions, a horror tale; a period gold rush tale; and a pre-World War II British espionage thriller that I am excited about. Basically, I am working in three mediums, prose work, graphic novels and films, so it’s stimulating for me. I hope all will see the light of day. That is what I am working on.

I want to thank Matt for sharing this information on the blog, and those looking to learn more about Tales of Sley House can visit the publisher, here. 

New Interview Posted at Geek Chic Elite

Writer Jeff Fountain at Geek Chic Elite just posted an interview with me regarding my latest book, The X-Files FAQ, the impending series revival, and my writing career. We had a great chat, and I hope you enjoy reading it.

We also hit on a lot of other topics close to my heart, including some on Millennium and even a little on Space:1999. 

Please check out the whole interview, at Geek Chic Elite, and let me know what you think!

My Interview (from 2005) with Link (1986) Director Richard Franklin

In 2005, while I was writing Horror Films of the 1980s for McFarland, I had the opportunity and honor to interview late director Richard Franklin (1948 – 2007) about the film I reviewed on the blog today, Link (1986).  

Mr. Franklin was very generous with his time, and this interview occurred on November 20, 2005.

Some -- though not all -- of this material, appeared in the published book, but I thought it would be nice, today, to share the back-and-forth as it appeared originally, only cleaned up for purposes of clarity

The topic moves from Link to horror movies of the eighties in general.

Muir: Describe the genesis of Link.

Richard Franklin: My landlord (DP Tom Ackerman) on a spec trip in 1979 showed me the story and I optioned it. It was to have been my next film after Road Games.

Muir: What was it about this material that stimulated you as a filmmaker?

Richard Franklin: The opening line in the synopsis: “Someone pulled the head off of Mrs. Murphy’s cat.” The idea that an animal could be acting like a man acting like an animal. An ironic spin on Michael Myers and the whole genre. Then learning from Jane Goodall that there was some truth to this [idea].

Muir: Phillip gives Jane a set of rules to obey. Was part of the fun of this film giving viewers these rules and then having characters break them?

Richard Franklin: Shades of Gremlins (1984)!

Muir: Was there a long period of rehearsal on this film to get the actors and crew familiar with working with apes?

Richard Franklin: No. We left the apes to Ray Berwick (who did The Birds [1963]).

Muir: How long was the shoot?

Richard Franklin: Quite long. Fifty-four days.

Muir: How did Link and the other apes take direction?

Richard Franklin: They could do short (15 – 20 second) behaviors. And didn’t argue. But [they] lost interest quickly.

Muir: Were there delays?

Richard Franklin: It was a grindingly difficult shoot. But not because of the apes. I found the English crew very slow and difficult.

Muir: How did Elisabeth Shue do with her ape co-stars?

Richard Franklin: I believe she loved them.

Muir: The final chase in the movie is electrifying. How long did it take to stage and execute?

Richard Franklin: You mean the siege in the house? Maybe a week. And thank you. No one’s ever said that before.

Muir: Had you storyboarded it all out?

Richard Franklin: Yes. Without that we’d have been lost.  Link has something like three times the number of shots of any of my other movies.

Muir: I notice there are many long shots there. Your fluid camera and choice of shots make it clear where everyone is in relationship to each other.

Richard Franklin. Absolutely! And thanks for noticing. Maybe I’m a neo-classicist.

Muir: What do you think the film ultimately says about man/ape relationships?

Richard Franklin: That we are alike – and different. That civilization (political correctness and the like) is a thin veneer. Yet that 1% genetic difference makes a HUGE difference.

Muir: What happened regarding the release of the film?

Richard Franklin: EMI went belly up. Cannon inherited the film and those guys were absolute bozos.

Muir: I didn’t find it until a home video release, and I suspect the film wasn’t released theatrically in the States.

Richard Franklin: It had a small theatrical airing.

Muir: What was the problem, if you recall? Why did this film get lost and is it still lost, in a sense?

Richard Franklin: Inept distribution. It happens a lot – particularly to me. Look at Visitors (2003).

Muir: What do you think a student of films should understand about your sensibilities as a filmmaker?

Richard Franklin: I’m a neo-classicist. [I] believe traditional mise-en-scene can’t be beaten. [I] hate “wobbly-cam” (aping home videos) as it draws attention to itself and gets in the way of emotion (cf John Ford’s idea of “invisible technique,” which you’ll see more of in my later work like Hotel Sorrento/Sorrento Beach [1995].)

Muir: Do you think young directors working today still understand film grammar and how to use it?

Richard Franklin: Somewhat.

Muir: Which of your films in the 1980s best express your viewpoint as a filmmaker?

Richard Franklin: Psycho II (1983) is the best anyway.

Muir: If you had to choose one to film to show a class, which one would it be?

Richard Franklin: I just showed the new [Psycho II] DVD to a class.

Muir: What do you think of the trend of slasher films in the 1980s? Was it good for horror, or do you think it was a blind alley?

Richard Franklin: Maybe good for horror, but not necessarily “the thriller.” This genre once included North by Northwest (1959), but psychological suspense like Gaslight (1944) or The Cat and the Canary (1939) has sort of disappeared in favour of grue.  To me, the best screen murder ever is Nancy’s in Lean’s Oliver Twist (1948), and the scariest scene ever is the Indian raid in The Searchers (1956).

Muir: Do you have any favorite horror films from the decade?

Richard Franklin: Any suggestions? I like Halloween (1978), but that was the seventies.

Muir: What are about Dressed to Kill (1980)?

Richard Franklin: Brian is drawn to different values in Hitchcock’s work from those that attract me.

Muir: The Shining (1980)?

Richard Franklin: Some fantastic moments, but a bit labored. Kubrick (late in his career) underestimated his audience.

Muir: The Fly? (1986)

Richard Franklin: Fun, in a light way.

(At this point, my questions were all answered.)

Muir: Thanks again for your time!”

Richard Franklin: Hope my ideas do not cause offence. By all means come back for more…”

From the Archive: Paul Dooley

John's note: I conducted this interview with comedian Paul Dooley in 2003, while I was researching my book, Best in Show: The Films of Christopher Guest and Company. The subject of the interview was the cult kid's show, The Electric Company.

Interview with Paul Dooley

Paul Dooley may be best-known to contemporary audiences as the cantankerous father-in-law of Larry David on HBO's Curb Your Enthusiasm, or perhaps as a semi-regular in director Christopher Guest's repertory company, in comedies such as Waiting for Guffman (1997) and A Mighty Wind (2003). However, three decades ago, the acclaimed actor, talented improviser, and respected graduate of Second City played another important role: he "turned on" a generation of American kids to the joys and rewards of reading as the head-writer of the PBS education series The Electric Company during its initial season.

Recently, Dooley, who has guest-starred on TV series as diverse as Star Trek: Deep Space Nine (as a Cardassian!), Seinfeld, Tales from the Darkside, Grace Under Fire and Millennium ("The Well Worn Lock"), shared his recollections about The Electric Company, and his behind-the-scenes effort to promote literacy while entertaining the youth of the 1970s.

Muir: How did you come to be involved writing The Electric Company?

Dooley: Well, I didn't know it until years later, but Carl Reiner recommended me for the job. Carl appeared on Sesame Street, as many celebrities did during the first year or two, like my friend, Carol Burnett. They would come on and recite the alphabet or count to ten, just a little short thing they could film in a half-hour and then leave. So when Carl was there, he was asked by the producers if he knew any good writers in New York, because they were trying to put together a new show. He said, 'Paul Dooley's a funny guy, and he lives here.' And I never knew this until the job was over! Twenty-five years later, I finally got to say 'thanks.' I met Carl at a writer's guild screening of a movie and stopped him and said 'I heard you recommended me for The Electric Company years ago.'

Muir: Why do a follow-up TV series to Sesame Street?

Dooley: The producers wanted to address actual reading problems, not just A B C, 1 2 3. They began to realize from Sesame Street that kids were learning from it and wanted more. They were doing it so well after one season of Sesame Street that they had the alphabet; they had their numbers. They also learned things like fairness and morality. The producers started to go further and began to do short words and syllables, and then realized there was a need for another show. Sesame Street was for ages three to six, and our show was from six to nine or ten, just when you are learning to read. Research showed them that this was something that kids were ready for, and could make a difference.

Muir: How did work on the series begin?

Dooley: They had funding of seven million dollars for the first season. They didn't know what would be the title, the format, the cast, or the writing. They didn't know how any of that would work. So they made a decision to have some experimental writing done. They brought in seven writers to work on it, and I was one of them. I thought when they asked me to do it that it was a six week job, and that they got a hold of me because I was known in New York as a writer of radio commercials. I spent a great deal of time in the advertising business right out of Second City. First, I was hired to take copy and make it better. Then I'd spike it up with humor or character or even timing. And after a while I realized they were only paying me as an actor when I was writing the whole thing!

Muir: So your experience in writing and performing in radio ads was a plus on a childrens' show?

Dooley: Well, with children you tend to do short segments because of the attention span, which was why Sesame Street had short pieces, animation and songs. So it was similar to commercials in some important ways.

Muir: So the group of seven began imagining the new series...

Dooley: Well, we all wrote in this kind of limbo for six weeks. Then, at the end of that time, the producers came to me and said they'd like me to sign a contract and be the head writer for the first season and supervise the material and be in charge of the shape of it. Which immediately made the other six guys hate me, because we had been peers. The reason that the producer told me he thought I was the guy to do it was that the other folks had written sketches that just seemed to be in limbo and could be used or not used, and had no cohesion or shape to them. They didn't mean anything in aggregate. But totally unconsciously, what I created was a scene with a character who could be brought back once a week.

Muir: In fact, you created several of that series' most memorable and colorful characters. How did Fargo North, Decoder come about?

Dooley: I have a penchant for names, particularly pun names, so I named a guy Fargo North, Decoder. I was in a meeting with several reading experts who were giving a crash course in reading techniques, and we had to teach reading to the audience, so we had a lot to learn. The experts used a lot of twenty-five dollar words like"encode" for reading and "decode" for reading. So I was sitting next to another writer who was a friend of mine and I wrote in the margin of my notes, "Fargo North, Decoder." Just a little riff, you know. He told the producer about it the next day and he said to me, 'That's a funny idea, let's do something with it.' So I figured he [Fargo] could be a word detective and I kind of based him on Inspector Clouseau, a guy who was tripping over his feet all the time. And then it turned out that almost every sketch I thought of could be used as a running character.

Muir: Tell me about another of your characters, J. Arthur Crank.

Dooley: He was a guy who calls up to complain. I named him J. Arthur Crank based on J. Arthur Rank. And of course, no kid is going to know J. Arthur Rank, and most of their parents - if they were under thirty - weren't going to know him either. But I think it didn't hurt anything, and had a ring to it. And the few people who did hear it and knew Rank would think it was cute. He was a crank caller and instead of just calling him Crank, I called him J. Arthur Crank.

Muir: You've hit on one of the delights of The Electric Company. It was educational and funny for the kids, but there were also little jokes in there that only the adults would get.

Dooley: we did things for the adults that kids might not get, but it didn't cost us anything. The Electric Company had a hip-ness about it. We were told never to look or sound anything like Sesame Street. We didn't want some six-year-old kid to say, 'I'm not going to watch that, that's just like Sesame Street! That's for little kids!'

Muir: You also created a very famous character -- played by the actor Morgan Freeman, before he was a star.

Dooley: Easy Reader. He was based on Easy Rider, but he was a junkie for reading, and that was Morgan Freeman. And the counterpoint of the junkie for reading is the Count on Sesame Street. He could not stop counting. To a fault. So I made a guy who would not stop reading to a fault, and that was Easy Reader.

Muir: Where did the idea come from to call the series The Electric Company?

Dooley: The reason we called it The Electric Company is that the first name we made for it had the word eclectic in it. The producers kept saying that were were going to be very eclectic in our reading techniques, phonics, all these different things, so we would kid around with the word eclectic. Like, 'did you pay the eclectic bill?' And eventually, somehow, we called it The Eclectic Company, and then The Electric Company.

Muir: And the theme song took it from there.

Dooley: Joe Raposa wrote this wonderful opening song. I said 'Let's suppose it is The Electric Company, what would you write? What kind of song would you have? And he wrote some great lyrics. 'We're going to turn you on, we're going to give you the power'...And it was terrific.

Muir: Other elements of the show also utilized the motif of electricity

Dooley: A lot of those things I thought of -- like having a hand come in at the end of the show and turn on the light bulb -- because we called it The Electric Company, and that tied it together. I created the line which said: 'Electric Company gets its power from the Children's Television Workshop,' based on Sesame Street, which said things like 'brought to you by the letter A.' I found a bunch of things to hang it on, which made it seem unified.

Muir: Do you ever feel like you've covertly educated a generation?

Dooley: We had this charge that if you make the show entertaining for the parents as well as the kids - if they sit with the kids - not only will the kids learn something about reading, but the parents might learn something they don't know either. Plus, if they sit with the kids, the kids are more likely to watch, and it becomes a family thing.

Muir: You left The Electric Company after one year as head writer...

Dooley: Yes. I worked on the first season and then went back to my real career. I was doing a lot better [financially] when I didn't work for them, because they had a pretty low salary. I was making four or five times as much by working on commercials. I did enjoy it, and it was challenging and rewarding. I said to my wife at the time, 'Finally, I'm doing something with comedy techniques for good instead of evil!'"

From the Archive: Brian Johnson (February 2001)

John's note: I conducted this interview with award-wining special effects guru Brian Johnson (Space:1999, Alien, The Empire Strikes Back, etc., in February 2001, via e-mail.  The subject was Space:1999, and the occasion was the new release of the Gerry and Sylvia Anderson series on DVD.

Interview with Brian Johnson

John:  After twenty-five years, the world finally seems to hve caught up with Space:1999 in some senses, with stories about the program running in The New York Times, Cinescape and TV Guide. And the series is being released on DVD. Did you know this day of re-assessment would come, and is there a sense of vindication?

Brian Johnson: I always tried to make Space:1999 a quality show in terms of visual effects. Vindication is not the word. Quiet satisfaction is probably nearer the mark.

John: Have you seen the DVDs?

Brian Johnson: I haven't, though I would like to. Every dog has his day, and the show deserves some extra acclaim. We all gave it our best bang for the buck.

John: I know you've mentioned that DVD is a different format than Space:1999 was originally intended for, and that the format throws off your "wire threshold." What exactly does that mean?

Brian Johnson: The resolution of TV images was low in those days. We had a margin with which we could view our dailies and say "That will never be seen on TV." I never re-shot stuff if I thought we couldn't improve the action, and it didn't show wires when projected at 25-30 frames per second, not rock and rolling and freeze-framing the way people do now, just to see how a shot is done. Wires were a bloody nuisance - I hated them. As often as possible, we avoided them.

John: If you were to do a new Space:1999 today, would you in any way change the look of the series? Do you see a role for CGI in a new Space:1999?

Brian Johnson: I would change everything - but not completely. The Eagles would be subtly changed with better undercarriage systems and "bits" on. The Moonbase could do with a spring clean, but not too much. I liked the launch pads. The planets would be much better now. I would use a huge amount of CGI work. I would shoot digitally and make subtle camera moves to enhance production values.

John: The Eagle may be one of the most beloved and believable spaceship designs in TV history. Can you tell us how you came to design it?

Brian Johnson: I was in my "modular" design mode in those days. I reasoned that it made sense to make Pods that were interchangeable. The command pod could serve as a lifeboat, Eagles could be "chained" together, etc. I sketched the basic idea and got Michael Lamont (then a draughtsman/art department) to draw up the full scale 44" plans. I then added sections and thickened tubes until it looked "right." The final cladding was added, and then the different scale versions were finished to match the 44" model. My basic ideas came from looking at dragonflies and insects of all sorts. I copied nature to some degree - I think it made the Eagle believable.

John: Moonbase Alpha?

Brian Johnson: Moonbase Alpha was an unashamed homage to Harry Lange, Tony Masters and Stanley Kubrick from 2001, with my own ideas too.

John: One of the things that constantly amazes me about your work is how the miniatures of Space:1999 blended so seamlessly with the live action. How did you manage to coordinate the live action with the miniatures on so tight a schedule?

Brian Johnson: I was always about ten days behind the Main unit live action shooting, so Keith Wilson would do his thing. I tried never to interfere with his imagination, and we used the Main Unit shots as keys to our establishing shots. The trick was to "lag" the Main Unit. Also, editor Dave Lane was just the best at using everything we shot.

John: What was the one thing you wanted to do on Space:1999 that you never had the opportunity to do?

Brian Johnson: Motion controlled moves and such, but we didn't have time or money. We had just started to build our first motion control system, but it was cranky and slow.

John: At the time it aired, Space:1999 was roundly criticized for being mystical and anti-science. What do you think about such criticisms?

Brian Johnson: I have to confess that I was never really moved by the concept of Space:1999. I find the most exciting sci-fi ideas are those that obtain some semblance of reality. Frankly, the Moon traveling through space (other than in the company of the Earth) is dumb. We would have stood a better chance if we had been an Asteroid Mining Company, or something. I could have really gone to town in terms of visuals. We had good writers and good directors, and yet we never really got to know the main characters. It was all a little superficial. However, I am being picky here, and in its time, it did push the frontiers a bit. I think TV politics had something to do with the demise of the series.

John: What were the primary strengths of Space:1999, in your eyes?

Brian Johnson: Quality and attention to detail. A whole slew of superb actors who lifted some of the more esoteric storylines. Good directors like Charles Crichton, who, because of his background, was given the weakest scripts.

John: The primary weaknesses?

Brian Johnson: We didn't really progress as we went from Series 1 to Series 2. I still feel the first series had the best stories. The whole Maya thing was just a gimmick, though Catherine was superb, and we took on board an established American script advisor who led us away from the audience we had already established. I don't know what figures were charged for each episode, but I think the quality we put out allowed a much higher figure to be charged than was actually the case. If the unit cost was less, we might have gone on for years. Hopefully on an asteroid, not the Moon!

John: Any thoughts on the fans?

Brian Johnson: I'm always amazed by the enthusiasm and loyalty shown by so many different types of people. From the absolute nutter through the sci-fi buff, to the cerebral. Even Mums have a lot of nice things to say about the show - maybe it kept their kids quiet for an hour or so. I also do not have the retention of memory for lines in the script that many fans can recite, ad infinitum. I'm always flattered by the nice things they say about Eagles and Moonbase Alpha.

From the Archive: John Newland

John's note: This interview with John Newland, director and host of One Step Beyond, was conducted in the year 1999, as I was researching my book, An Analytical Guide to TV's One Step Beyond.  Mr. Newland -- a true gentleman and great talent -- passed away in 2000.

Interview with John Newland

John Newland came of age as a theatrical artist just as television developed into a national obsession.

Perhaps the foremost leading man of the 1950s, Newland guest-starred on programs such as Playhouse 90 (1956-1961), The Loretta Young Show (1953-1961), Kraft Television Theatre (1947-1958), Climax (1954-1958), Suspense (1949-1964), Studio One (1948-1958), Robert Montgomery Presents (1950-1957), Tales of Tomorrow (1951-1953), Science Fiction Theater (1955-1957) and Inner Sanctum (1954).

Though Newland is best remembered for his role as the host of One Step Beyond and its syndicated sequel, The Next Step Beyond (1978-79), he also had a long and distinguished career as a TV director, helming episodes of Police Woman (1974-1978), The Man From U.N.C.L.E. (1964-1968), Dr. Kildare (1961-1966), Star Trek (1966-1969), Rod Serling's Night Gallery (1970-1973), The Sixth Sense (1972) and Wonder Woman (1976-1978).

He also directed the memorable (and chilling...) TV movie starring Kim Darby, Don't Be Afraid of the Dark (1973).

The following interview focuses on the production of One Step Beyond:

MUIR: How did you come to be involved with Alcoa Presents, the series known now and forever as One Step Beyond?

NEWLAND: Producers Merwin Gerard and Collier Young were my friends, and we had done other shows together. We came up with idea of doing a program called Fantasy, a series that would highlight fantasy one week, horror the next, science fiction the next, and so on. But all those things had been done before, so we decided to focus on psychic phenomena instead. There were so many sources to call on for stories, and we had Larry Marcus, a formidable writer, and I would direct the episodes.

MUIR: And that was how the pilot "The Bride Possessed" came about?"

NEWLAND: Yes. We made "The Bride Possessed," and it had enough visual appeal to make the series seem worthwhile.

MUIR: Do you recall how much it cost to make the pilot (in 1959)?

NEWLAND: Around $30,000 dollars, I believe. We shopped it around, and Alcoa liked the show, so it became our sponsor.

MUIR: One of the things that made One Step Beyond so unusual was that many of the episodes were based on reported accounts of the paranormal, "based on fact," as it were. "Night of April 14" concerned a psychic web surrounding the sinking of the Titanic. "The Day the World Wept" reported President Lincoln's precognitive dreams of his own assassination, and "Earthquake" and "Eye Witness" told of people who forecasted real life natural disasters, such as the quake of 1916, or the volcanic eruption at Krakatoa.

NEWLAND: That's right. The stories had to be real, and there had to be proof, either anecdotal or published. Of course, we got some letters from people who said I was the Anti-Christ for pursuing this kind of thing. Ivan Klapper was our consultant, and it was just as the narration said. [He breaks into the series narration here - and it's a little uncanny to hear the voice coming through my phone]: 'Explain it? We cannot. Disprove it? We cannot. We are simply inviting audiences to explore the unknown.."

MUIR: How long did it take to film the average episode of One Step Beyond?

NEWLAND: Three days. We'd work for five days a week, stop for two days to take a breather, and then start shooting again. We had a spectacular crew.

MUIR: And the budget per regular half-hour show?

NEWLAND: Between $30,000 and $50,000, I believe.

MUIR: And the shows were mostly shot inside. In the studio, right?

NEWLAND: We shot on the MGM lot. And we had access to their vast costume department, which meant that we could do period pieces.

MUIR: Were you allowed to improvise dialogue, or re-write any of the teleplays on the set, or were the stories pretty much filmed as written?

NEWLAND: We didn't need to improvise. We had good actors, good movement and good dialogue. We had four cameras, and the benefit of vast experience.

MUIR: Did you have complete creative control in your directing choices?

NEWLAND: I had a totally free hand...and a lot of help too! Henry Berman [editor of the series] was a major reason for the success of One Step Beyond. After lunch on any given day of shooting, he would approach me and let me know what he thought he needed in order to deliver a satisfactory cut.

MUIR: What kind of advice did he usually have?

NEWLAND: He would say: 'I need a two-shot here, John,' etcetera. And usually his recommendation was something that would have never entered my mind. Cutters are very helpful to directors, and I always listened to Henry and placed stock in his advice/

MUIR: What were your feelings about Harry Lubin, who wrote the creepy signature music of One Step Beyond? That theme, "Fear" still gives me shivers whenever I think of it....

NEWLAND: Harry was a very articulate man, and a great composer, and he really loved the idea of the show. I think the music reflected his genuine interest and feel for the material. When an album of his work on One Step Beyond was released many years later, it was quite successful.

MUIR: Since One Step Beyond was an anthology, you had the opportunity to work with a variety of famous performers. Can I ask about some of your memories of the actors who appeared on the show?

NEWLAND: Sure.

MUIR: Suzanne Pleshette appeared in "Delusion," the premiere of the second season. She played a duplicitous nasty girl, and the recipient of a blood-transfusion of a character played by Norman Lloyd. What was your impression of her?

NEWLAND: She was one of the best actresses I ever worked with. Period.

MUIR: In the print I saw of that episode, there was an abrupt cut as soon as Norman Lloyd began to strangle her. Was that a network-imposed cut, or did I just see a bad print?

NEWLAND: Well, I'm sure I told Norman to strangle her good. I don't recall if that cut was a result of the network asking us to change something.

MUIR: Any thoughts on William Shatner, who you worked with again on Star Trek? He appeared in "The Promise" as a German bomb expert, and gave a very sensitive and restrained performance....

NEWLAND: He's a charming actor, and a hard-working actor. I thought he was adorable, and he has been an excellent friend to me. I thought he gave a terrific performance in "The Promise.

MUIR: "The Visitor" was a deeply moving episode about how marriages can change over the years...with a psychic twist, of course. It featured a very young Warren Beatty as a man in his twenties, and then as the same character - but in his fifties. What was he like to direct?

NEWLAND: Warren was a friend. Of course he was a nobody back then, but Joan Fontaine [his co-star in "The Visitor"] wanted him for the part. I thought he was quite charming - and good in the role. He was dating Natalie Wood at that point, and she would come over to watch the dailies to see how he was holding up. He wasn't in [old-age] make-up that long, and it wasn't severe.

MUIR: Christopher Lee appeared in "The Sorcerer," just as he was becoming an international star for his portrayal of Dracula.

NEWLAND: Oh, he was funny and charming. He makes his living being spooky but he's really got a great sense of humor.

MUIR: How did you feel about the fact that you were always on-screen, in every episode, as the series narrator?

NEWLAND: That was a necessary selling point. Having me as an "established star" of television at the time, helped get the show sold.

MUIR: Part of your job, as I recall, was to hawk aluminum products for your sponsor, Alcoa. Was it ever awkward being their pitch-man?

NEWLAND: That was just part of the business. They were happy with my work, and I was happy with their money. It was a good relationship.

MUIR: While you were shooting the first season of One Step Beyond, you had an interesting encounter with Rod Serling, is that correct?

NEWLAND: I knew Rod, and he knew me as a director, and he was a splendid person to work with, and a real supporter. He called me up and asked me to meet him for drinks. Well, once we were at the bar, Serling told me he was going to be producing and writing an anthology series of his own. He assured me that The Twilight Zone was going to be pure fantasy, with no discussion of proof or psychic powers.

MUIR: Why do you think he wanted to tell you that?

NEWLAND: Because he was a class act. He just wanted to let me know in person that he wasn't going to rip us off.

MUIR: Any favorites among the 96 episodes of One Step Beyond?

NEWLAND: I liked "The Devil's Laughter" [ a story about a criminal who kept escaping the noose by luck]. The story was good, I liked Alfred Ryder's performance, and felt engaged by the storyline.

MUIR: Least favorite?

NEWLAND: The one about the vine in Mexico.

MUIR: That was "Blood Flower," about an American professor being possessed by the spirit of a Mexican revolutionary whose blood had spilled on a plant...

NEWLAND: It was a dumb, silly concept. The pits.

MUIR: One Step Beyond had a location shift for the last part of its third season. Thirteen episodes were filmed in Great Britain.

NEWLAND: That was my idea. We thought it would be a little boost to the show. Great Britain offered good actors, good locations, and good settings. We sought permission from Alcoa, and they okayed it.

MUIR: What was ABC's general response to One Step Beyond?

NEWLAND: They were very enthusiastic. The show always won its time slot. Alcoa was even more enthusiastic. It was a solid success.

MUIR: How much interference was there from Alcoa and the network?

NEWLAND: These were the days before Proctor and Gamble. We had a totally free hand.

MUIR: Do you know why the series was cancelled?

NEWLAND: We'd done 96 episodes, and there was the inescapable feeling that we were no longer the new kid on the block. The show was still drawing high ratings, but the decision was made that we needed to make room for new product.

MUIR: Okay, you know I've got to question you about the episode called "The Sacred Mushroom." This remains one of the most notorious episodes in network TV history, because you are seen on camera literally sampling mushrooms with hallucinogenic properties in a California laboratory. In your own words from the beginning of the show, "the story featured no actors, no script." Basically, it was a travelogue to Mexico to experiment with these mushrooms. What was going on with that story?

NEWLAND: That was our most popular episode. It was a spooky trip. We landed in a tiny airstrip in Mexico near a mission. From there, it was a donkey trip of four days to reach the village. It was a dangerous journey, but we got phenomenal footage.

MUIR: That portion of the episode involved Dr. Barbara Brown (a neuro-pharmacologist), David Grey (A Hawaiin spiritual leader), Dr. Jeffrey Smith (a philosophy professor from Stanford) and Dr. Andrija Puharch sampling a mushroom called "X," given to them by a local with doctor called a brujo. The peyote was supposed to enhance psychic abilities, and it was pretty damn unusual to see people getting high on TV in 1961, wasn't it?

NEWLAND: Alcoa told us that the show was so bizarre, that we don't dare put it on the air.

MUIR: So how did you salvage the episode?

NEWLAND: Well, Puharich asked me to take the mushroom, and I was game, so we took a camera crew and drove to Palo Alto and Puharich's laboratory. Once there, I had three cameras rolling the whole time, and I told the cameramen to just keep shooting until we ran out of film. We decided to shoot and shoot and shoot and see what happened.

MUIR: Did you feel anything strange when you sampled the mushroom?

NEWLAND: I felt light-headed...and a sense of well being...the stuff was distilled. It was very powerful, but not poisonous, so I didn't have any trepidations.

MUIR: Were there after-effects?"

NEWLAND: I had flashbacks and hallucinatory moments for about a month.

MUIR: But nothing psychic or paranormal happened?

NEWLAND: No. Not a grain.

MUIR: I guess I should ask you then, have you ever had a psychic or paranormal experience?

NEWLAND: I've not had a single experience. I'd like to have one, and if I were offered one, I'd certainly jump at it instantly.

MUIR: Going back to "The Sacred Mushroom," your involvement with Puharich in the lab saved the show for broadcast.

NEWLAND: Alcoa saw it and considered my testimony "proof enough," to air the show. As I said, it became our most popular episode.

MUIR: In 1978 you embarked on a syndicated sequel to One Step Beyond called The Next Step Beyond. It only lasted a season, and at first was shot on videotape.

NEWLAND: It was very inferior quality. We thought videotape was the medium of the future, but the results were not what we had in mind. We switched to 16mm halfway through the series to try to improve its look, but by then it was too late.

MUIR: With revivals of The Twilight Zone and The Outer Limits, has there been any serious thought about another new One Step Beyond?

NEWLAND: We talked about doing all kinds of revivals, even recently, but as The Next Step Beyond proved so dramatically, you just can't go home again.

MUIR: Is there any message you would like to share with fans of One Step Beyond?

NEWLAND: Thank you for your years of interest and belief. I am very grateful.

MUIR: And lastly what is your ultimate, final take on One Step Beyond, forty years later?

NEWLAND: It was the best production I ever worked on, period. It was the best time I had working in this industry, and it was the most creative and satisfying atmosphere in my life, both personally and professionally.